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eelynot
16-04-2008, 01:34 PM
At South Oakleigh bowls club ( the devils ) we are going to try and enter a third side this year and hoping to recruit over winter , we normally have about 10 that dont play on a Saturday but even with that many spares we still struggle just after xmas and during the spring carnival so I'm guessing we need
1. to get more committment and at least another 12 players so we dont forfeit or have to chase blokes up each saturday
2. We might pick up one or two from other clubs , but they.re usually pissed off about something when they arrive and may have some stupid belief about their ablilty

I,ve run junior programs and school programs at Clayton and while their good for morale of the club they dont always produce players in fact more often than not you get none, I ran one at Clayton and had a 120 kids turn up only to get one bowler out of it, but they may come back to the game later having had a go at it early on

What made bowls so popular 20 years ago when clubs had a waiting list to join, was it they were more social, an alternative to the pub , the blokes in their 70.s I meet tell me how popular Turkey triples on Sundays were how someone had to die for you to get a spot ( of course being a bowling club that did happen ) , now my limited maths tells me these blokes were all joining in their 50,s so is that the demographic bowls clubs should be aiming to recruit or blokes in their 40,s , the juniors will still be coming in and being the new champs but the bowling clubs would become stronger with the 40 and 50 year olds who apart from bolstering numbers also have disposable income.

Any further ideas ( longest post i've written, now I need a beer )
a

Swifty
16-04-2008, 01:46 PM
It's good to see you targetting the schools. We need to get the juniors into the game.

Only other suggestions I have are:

1. Corporate bowls. Some clubs have hundreds of them, others struggle. I don't know the right formula for getting them in, but when it works you do get a few full members out of it.

2. Social groups. Work social clubs, other sporting clubs, etc. Get them in, let them have a roll in their bare feet and plaster them with the cheap drinks. They'll have a ball, and they might come back and try the game seriously.

In both cases the point is simply to get new people to give the game a go. If they enjoy it, they'll come back for more. The hardest part is getting them there in the first place. So many times I try to get someone to come and try it out, only to be told "I'm not old enough for that yet". It's a hard stereotype to overcome. But so many people have a great time when they do try it.

damienj
16-04-2008, 01:48 PM
I think you have a point. I know at our club (upwey) we have recruited a group of 5 or 6 bowlers, all mates, they were indoor cricketers and golfers, and came across to bowls...

we also have a semi-close relationship with the cricket club and have snagged a few from there...

Its the way to go to i reckon...get these blokes who are still healthy, fit (well fit enough for bowls but maybe not for cricket!) and more importantly, will treat it as a sport..have that competitive edge!

Connections with the local sporting clubs is a good starting point for potential members IMHO!

16-04-2008, 02:26 PM
Tell them you will give them free membership first year plenty of coaching discounted beer and good looking women.
Guaranteed formula for attracting new bowlers ;)

Robbo
16-04-2008, 02:29 PM
Tell them you will give them free membership first year plenty of coaching discounted beer and good looking women.
Guaranteed formula for attracting new bowlers ;)

:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

Chalks1971
16-04-2008, 02:36 PM
Do what all the good clubs do, poach them!

dave
16-04-2008, 02:36 PM
Tell them you will give them free membership first year plenty of coaching discounted beer and good looking women.
Guaranteed formula for attracting new bowlers ;)

:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

It's OK Robbo ... with enough cheap beer ... there will be good looking women there ... :twisted: :twisted:

dave
16-04-2008, 02:37 PM
Do what all the good clubs do, poach them!

Yeah, worth a try ... as a matter of fact I'm going poaching tonight ... LOL

Swifty
16-04-2008, 02:43 PM
Tell them you will give them free membership first year plenty of coaching discounted beer and good looking women.
Guaranteed formula for attracting new bowlers ;)

I don't know about free membership, but at our club any first-time bowler gets their first year's membership for $10 (normally about $200). This is because they already have enough expense buying bowls, clothes, shoes, equipment etc.

eelynot
16-04-2008, 02:53 PM
Do what all the good clubs do, poach them!

Poaching isnt all that great an option we're a div 2 club so its not that attractive as an ambition thing, and i was prez at Clayton when we did some poaching when we won div 1 flag to go into premier , didnt really work as a team thing, anyway my original thread was more in line for all clubs what area do we target, we have the cricket and football club on the same parkland as us and they use our bar so there is some connection plus we have some of their old boys playing with us , but really I'm asking do you thing the age group all clubs should be trying to attract is the forty and over group to bolster club numbers , the RVBA seem to want to promote junior bowls and the 20 something age group, I think they're wasting their time and our money

Uncle Ken
16-04-2008, 02:58 PM
Yes.

Chalks1971
16-04-2008, 02:59 PM
Do what all the good clubs do, poach them![/quote

Poaching isnt all that great an option we're a div 2 club so its not that attractive as an ambition thing, and i was prez at Clayton when we did some poaching when we won div 1 flag to go into premier , didnt really work as a team thing, anyway my original thread was more in line for all clubs what area do we target, we have the cricket and football club on the same parkland as us and they use our bar so there is some connection plus we have some of their old boys playing with us , but really I'm asking do you thing the age group all clubs should be trying to attract is the forty and over group to bolster club numbers , the RVBA seem to want to promote junior bowls and the 20 something age group, I think they're wasting their time and our money

Sorry mate, been a tiring day, needed some humour, Im right now, I just read the Bowls Australia mission statement. :smile: :smile: :smile:

I think youre ideally located for growth in the future. Being co-located with other sporting clubs is brilliant. You need to get these guys on the green, without too many rules / costs (some here diagree re. costs, but they can jump in themselves). Maybe even look at some sort of sponsorship. Once they realise what game we've got, and you can have a drink (perhaps a smoke) and a bit of a laugh, but it takes skill and determination youll get some rewards.

16-04-2008, 03:01 PM
Tell them you will give them free membership first year plenty of coaching discounted beer and good looking women.
Guaranteed formula for attracting new bowlers ;)

I don't know about free membership, but at our club any first-time bowler gets their first year's membership for $10 (normally about $200). This is because they already have enough expense buying bowls, clothes, shoes, equipment etc.
We do a similar thing Swifty. Discounted first year membership and all the coaching you can eat :cheers:

eelynot
16-04-2008, 03:14 PM
When you say free membership, do you cover their capitation fee . I was thinking of getting them to pay the captiation fee and either then a free membership , ours is only $ 55 or getting them to pay $ 55 as a bar levy , then we get half back when they use it.

The other problem I meant to mention earlier with junior recruitment , as soon as we got some young gun , I could see some flaming club nearby climbing over our fence to get their hands on him.

moosc
16-04-2008, 03:20 PM
The RVBA and clubs should have targeted the "Baby Boomer" generation when it was in its forties.
"No" they said... "we are aiming for the retiring people". :grin:
They could have looked at the retrenched people in the 1980's who were looking for low cost sport involvement. "No" they said... "we are aiming for the retiring people". :grin:

Result was they were lost to Golf and other activities. We are now paying for that short sightedness :roll:

Neil W

16-04-2008, 03:21 PM
When you say free membership, do you cover their capitation fee . I was thinking of getting them to pay the captiation fee and either then a free membership , ours is only $ 55 or getting them to pay $ 55 as a bar levy , then we get half back when they use it.

The other problem I meant to mention earlier with junior recruitment , as soon as we got some young gun , I could see some flaming club nearby climbing over our fence to get their hands on him.
No! That would never happen.

Guard against it. Start you're own junior program, get some gun coaches and mentors in. Simple as that :smile:

David South
16-04-2008, 04:32 PM
I sugest there are a number of stages in recruiting members.

Firstly, you have to get non-bowlers onto the green to have a go at bowls. Mostly they come because they have friends who have tried it already, and bring them along. Getting the first few in is very difficult - it gets easier and easier as the place gets the reputation as a good place to be. You have to set the right atmosphere, the right music, the right lighting, the right dress code, the right opening hours, the right staff, the right prices. Not much different to what a publican has to do to get people in. I believe the best target market for us is people in the age group 28-45, but that might depend on where you are. It is harder to get people with children in. I think we have missed the baby boomers. Corporate functions get a lot of people in, and make money, but are pretty unproductive in terms of return visits. I believe schoolkids are pretty much a waste of time. Very few of them stick with it.

2 The casuals you get will not have much committment to anything other than a few bowls rolled down with friends whenever they feel like it however. You will not get many (if any) to jump straight from that level of commitment to making themselves available for a whole Saturday afternoon, every Saturday for 18 weeks. With rare exceptions, they just won't. Some intermediate level competition has to be devised, that will require a bit more commitment than just playing casually, but not much more. You might start by organising one-off two hour three bowl triples tournaments in the evening, for casuals. The next stage might be organised 2 hour games of triples once a week - perhaps 6 teams (of 3 people) playing each other once. That would be a five week competition. Mufti, bare feet OK, club bowls provided. Probably best in the evenings - therefore hard outside daylight saving time without lights. Could try mornings if you can organise child-care.

3 The third stage would be to then get them to plays bowls as we know it.

I don't think much of the parasite Clubs, that grow by poaching players from other Clubs.

Swifty
16-04-2008, 04:45 PM
What I've found to be a good intermediate level at our club is Sunday morning Scroungers. Played in mufti, in a friendly and casual atmosphere, but with a competitive edge, and designed to promote draw bowling. Plus you don't have to turn up every week if you don't feel like it. The social get-together that follows (sometimes ALL day!) helps as well.

I started playing Scroungers in June of my first year, and by November I was in my first Pennant side. I found it was a great way to start. We've gained quite a few other full members from it as well.

16-04-2008, 04:53 PM
At South Oakleigh bowls club ( the devils ) we are going to try and enter a third side this year and hoping to recruit over winter , we normally have about 10 that dont play on a Saturday but even with that many spares we still struggle just after xmas and during the spring carnival so I'm guessing we need
1. to get more committment and at least another 12 players so we dont forfeit or have to chase blokes up each saturday
2. We might pick up one or two from other clubs , but they.re usually pissed off about something when they arrive and may have some stupid belief about their ablilty

I,ve run junior programs and school programs at Clayton and while their good for morale of the club they dont always produce players in fact more often than not you get none, I ran one at Clayton and had a 120 kids turn up only to get one bowler out of it, but they may come back to the game later having had a go at it early on

What made bowls so popular 20 years ago when clubs had a waiting list to join, was it they were more social, an alternative to the pub , the blokes in their 70.s I meet tell me how popular Turkey triples on Sundays were how someone had to die for you to get a spot ( of course being a bowling club that did happen ) , now my limited maths tells me these blokes were all joining in their 50,s so is that the demographic bowls clubs should be aiming to recruit or blokes in their 40,s , the juniors will still be coming in and being the new champs but the bowling clubs would become stronger with the 40 and 50 year olds who apart from bolstering numbers also have disposable income.

Any further ideas ( longest post i've written, now I need a beer )
a




The only reason clubs were successful was because of the 6 o'clock swill. When licensing opened up it wasn't necessary to be a member of a club to get a drink after 6pm. Hence clubs statred to dwindle in members. Why pay membership when the pub down the road is now open later.

PB
16-04-2008, 04:53 PM
Biggest problem now in being able to judge how many sides to put in is that it's extremely difficult to get new members to commit to play every Saturday. You have to accept that any new member under 50 will miss up to 5 games a season due to outside commitments, unfortunately this is generally in the Spring or January which makes it harder.

Work out how many bowling members you have and allow at about 4-5 extra per side to cover for dropout and injuries.

MrInvisible
16-04-2008, 05:05 PM
Damien mentioned earlier that we had done some work with the local cricket club and gained a couple of new players as a result.

On another level this season at Upwey we changed to the Upwey Tigers and changed our colours to the black and yellow and will shortly recieve our new shirts.

This aligns us with the other clubs that surround our bowling club, the footy, cricket, basketball and netball ALL Upwey Tigers - it places us clearly in the local sporting community.

A few of us see the sponsorship opportuntiy that this sort of association brings but in the medium to longer term hopefully it will make the membership drives easier as the transistion from a Cricket Tiger to a Bowls Tiger will seem natural.

I'm not suggesting for a moment that this would suit a lot of clubs but with declining membership we have look outside the box for ideas that mgiht turn the numbers around.

eelynot
16-04-2008, 07:10 PM
The only reason clubs were successful was because of the 6 o'clock swill. When licensing opened up it wasn't necessary to be a member of a club to get a drink after 6pm. Hence clubs statred to dwindle in members. Why pay membership when the pub down the road is now open later.[/quote]

Well Mick then why wouldnt a licenced club offering pots at $2.50 compared to $3.50 be just as successful , and they didnt play pennant after 6pm , no theres got to be more to it, maybe its just a generational thing

Keith Maniac
17-04-2008, 09:57 AM
At South Oakleigh bowls club ( the devils ) we are going to try and enter a third side this year and hoping to recruit over winter , we normally have about 10 that dont play on a Saturday but even with that many spares we still struggle just after xmas and during the spring carnival so I'm guessing we need
1. to get more committment and at least another 12 players so we dont forfeit or have to chase blokes up each saturday
2. We might pick up one or two from other clubs , but they.re usually pissed off about something when they arrive and may have some stupid belief about their ablilty

I,ve run junior programs and school programs at Clayton and while their good for morale of the club they dont always produce players in fact more often than not you get none, I ran one at Clayton and had a 120 kids turn up only to get one bowler out of it, but they may come back to the game later having had a go at it early on

What made bowls so popular 20 years ago when clubs had a waiting list to join, was it they were more social, an alternative to the pub , the blokes in their 70.s I meet tell me how popular Turkey triples on Sundays were how someone had to die for you to get a spot ( of course being a bowling club that did happen ) , now my limited maths tells me these blokes were all joining in their 50,s so is that the demographic bowls clubs should be aiming to recruit or blokes in their 40,s , the juniors will still be coming in and being the new champs but the bowling clubs would become stronger with the 40 and 50 year olds who apart from bolstering numbers also have disposable income.

Any further ideas ( longest post i've written, now I need a beer )
a




The only reason clubs were successful was because of the 6 o'clock swill. When licensing opened up it wasn't necessary to be a member of a club to get a drink after 6pm. Hence clubs statred to dwindle in members. Why pay membership when the pub down the road is now open later.

Rubbish! The six o'clock swill ended in Victoria in 1966! That's a hell of a lot further back than 20 years, Mick! :shock:

17-04-2008, 09:58 AM
The only reason clubs were successful was because of the 6 o'clock swill. When licensing opened up it wasn't necessary to be a member of a club to get a drink after 6pm. Hence clubs statred to dwindle in members. Why pay membership when the pub down the road is now open later.

Well Mick then why wouldnt a licenced club offering pots at $2.50 compared to $3.50 be just as successful , and they didnt play pennant after 6pm , no theres got to be more to it, maybe its just a generational thing[/quote]



As we know the bulk of the numbers are still from that era, although their death and retirement has shrunk numbers accordingly. The higher sides in most clubs boast a younger crew who would not remember those days.

It is the wide variety of alternatives that slowed growth and only just recently, in the scheme of things has bowls started flying above the radar in the mind of the general public.

The barefoot and corporate phenomenon has turned peoples eyes back on the game and has given them access that was not available at any time earlier in the games history.

The rest is up to us bowlers through their clubs to turn it around by offering attractive alternative events for social bowlers. Casual golfers are probably the closest model.

17-04-2008, 10:03 AM
At South Oakleigh bowls club ( the devils ) we are going to try and enter a third side this year and hoping to recruit over winter , we normally have about 10 that dont play on a Saturday but even with that many spares we still struggle just after xmas and during the spring carnival so I'm guessing we need
1. to get more committment and at least another 12 players so we dont forfeit or have to chase blokes up each saturday
2. We might pick up one or two from other clubs , but they.re usually pissed off about something when they arrive and may have some stupid belief about their ablilty

I,ve run junior programs and school programs at Clayton and while their good for morale of the club they dont always produce players in fact more often than not you get none, I ran one at Clayton and had a 120 kids turn up only to get one bowler out of it, but they may come back to the game later having had a go at it early on

What made bowls so popular 20 years ago when clubs had a waiting list to join, was it they were more social, an alternative to the pub , the blokes in their 70.s I meet tell me how popular Turkey triples on Sundays were how someone had to die for you to get a spot ( of course being a bowling club that did happen ) , now my limited maths tells me these blokes were all joining in their 50,s so is that the demographic bowls clubs should be aiming to recruit or blokes in their 40,s , the juniors will still be coming in and being the new champs but the bowling clubs would become stronger with the 40 and 50 year olds who apart from bolstering numbers also have disposable income.

Any further ideas ( longest post i've written, now I need a beer )
a




The only reason clubs were successful was because of the 6 o'clock swill. When licensing opened up it wasn't necessary to be a member of a club to get a drink after 6pm. Hence clubs statred to dwindle in members. Why pay membership when the pub down the road is now open later.

Rubbish! The six o'clock swill ended in Victoria in 1966! That's a hell of a lot further back than 20 years, Mick! :shock:




You surprise me! Are you telling me the plethora of private clubs was not due to the licensing laws? If you are youare not the historian you claim to be.

It took time for the waiting lists to dwindle and the lack of foresight from clubs holding dearly onto their little patch. It wasn't a very welcoming game, a lot of pomp and procedure when I joined up. 20 years ago is when the game started its serious decline.

But jeez Keefy you tell me, you've been around a lot longer than me...

Keith Maniac
17-04-2008, 10:36 AM
At South Oakleigh bowls club ( the devils ) we are going to try and enter a third side this year and hoping to recruit over winter , we normally have about 10 that dont play on a Saturday but even with that many spares we still struggle just after xmas and during the spring carnival so I'm guessing we need
1. to get more committment and at least another 12 players so we dont forfeit or have to chase blokes up each saturday
2. We might pick up one or two from other clubs , but they.re usually pissed off about something when they arrive and may have some stupid belief about their ablilty

I,ve run junior programs and school programs at Clayton and while their good for morale of the club they dont always produce players in fact more often than not you get none, I ran one at Clayton and had a 120 kids turn up only to get one bowler out of it, but they may come back to the game later having had a go at it early on

What made bowls so popular 20 years ago when clubs had a waiting list to join, was it they were more social, an alternative to the pub , the blokes in their 70.s I meet tell me how popular Turkey triples on Sundays were how someone had to die for you to get a spot ( of course being a bowling club that did happen ) , now my limited maths tells me these blokes were all joining in their 50,s so is that the demographic bowls clubs should be aiming to recruit or blokes in their 40,s , the juniors will still be coming in and being the new champs but the bowling clubs would become stronger with the 40 and 50 year olds who apart from bolstering numbers also have disposable income.

Any further ideas ( longest post i've written, now I need a beer )
a




The only reason clubs were successful was because of the 6 o'clock swill. When licensing opened up it wasn't necessary to be a member of a club to get a drink after 6pm. Hence clubs statred to dwindle in members. Why pay membership when the pub down the road is now open later.

Rubbish! The six o'clock swill ended in Victoria in 1966! That's a hell of a lot further back than 20 years, Mick! :shock:




You surprise me! Are you telling me the plethora of private clubs was not due to the licensing laws? If you are youare not the historian you claim to be.

It took time for the waiting lists to dwindle and the lack of foresight from clubs holding dearly onto their little patch. It wasn't a very welcoming game, a lot of pomp and procedure when I joined up. 20 years ago is when the game started its serious decline.

But jeez Keefy you tell me, you've been around a lot longer than me...

There you go, twisting again. You brought up the "six o'clock swill" in your argument, but the original point was about numbers lost in the last 20 years. How is the "six o'clock swill" relevant when, by your own statements, there is a 20 year gap between it and the start of the "decline"? It would NOT take 20 years for waiting lists to run down.

But, of course, you follow your own interpretations. Why change? :roll:

17-04-2008, 10:52 AM
[quote=eelynot]At South Oakleigh bowls club ( the devils ) we are going to try and enter a third side this year and hoping to recruit over winter , we normally have about 10 that dont play on a Saturday but even with that many spares we still struggle just after xmas and during the spring carnival so I'm guessing we need
1. to get more committment and at least another 12 players so we dont forfeit or have to chase blokes up each saturday
2. We might pick up one or two from other clubs , but they.re usually pissed off about something when they arrive and may have some stupid belief about their ablilty

I,ve run junior programs and school programs at Clayton and while their good for morale of the club they dont always produce players in fact more often than not you get none, I ran one at Clayton and had a 120 kids turn up only to get one bowler out of it, but they may come back to the game later having had a go at it early on

What made bowls so popular 20 years ago when clubs had a waiting list to join, was it they were more social, an alternative to the pub , the blokes in their 70.s I meet tell me how popular Turkey triples on Sundays were how someone had to die for you to get a spot ( of course being a bowling club that did happen ) , now my limited maths tells me these blokes were all joining in their 50,s so is that the demographic bowls clubs should be aiming to recruit or blokes in their 40,s , the juniors will still be coming in and being the new champs but the bowling clubs would become stronger with the 40 and 50 year olds who apart from bolstering numbers also have disposable income.

Any further ideas ( longest post i've written, now I need a beer )
a




The only reason clubs were successful was because of the 6 o'clock swill. When licensing opened up it wasn't necessary to be a member of a club to get a drink after 6pm. Hence clubs statred to dwindle in members. Why pay membership when the pub down the road is now open later.

Rubbish! The six o'clock swill ended in Victoria in 1966! That's a hell of a lot further back than 20 years, Mick! :shock:




You surprise me! Are you telling me the plethora of private clubs was not due to the licensing laws? If you are youare not the historian you claim to be.

It took time for the waiting lists to dwindle and the lack of foresight from clubs holding dearly onto their little patch. It wasn't a very welcoming game, a lot of pomp and procedure when I joined up. 20 years ago is when the game started its serious decline.

But jeez Keefy you tell me, you've been around a lot longer than me...

There you go, twisting again. You brought up the "six o'clock swill" in your argument, but the original point was about numbers lost in the last 20 years. How is the "six o'clock swill" relevant when, by your own statements, there is a 20 year gap between it and the start of the "decline"? It would NOT take 20 years for waiting lists to run down.

But, of course, you follow your own interpretations. Why change? :roll:[/quote:1afexlj4]




OK, I'll explain it slower for you Keefy.

Melbourne's private and bowling clubs were a drinking alternative up until 1966 and were very strong with long waiting lists. When the 6 O'clock swill stopped, the game was still pretty healthy up until the late 80's, say 88/89, but that is when the major decline started.

Memberships were dying off quicker than new members were being found and pennant numbers declined accordingly. This trend continued for the next ten years, until barefoot bowls was inaugarated 10 years ago and the trend started to turn around again with a younger demographic being attracted to the game.

That more bowlers haven't been signed up is an indictment on the very average modality of most clubs.

Commie
17-04-2008, 11:04 AM
I sugest there are a number of stages in recruiting members.

Firstly, you have to get non-bowlers onto the green to have a go at bowls. Mostly they come because they have friends who have tried it already, and bring them along. Getting the first few in is very difficult - it gets easier and easier as the place gets the reputation as a good place to be. You have to set the right atmosphere, the right music, the right lighting, the right dress code, the right opening hours, the right staff, the right prices. Not much different to what a publican has to do to get people in. I believe the best target market for us is people in the age group 28-45, but that might depend on where you are. It is harder to get people with children in. I think we have missed the baby boomers. Corporate functions get a lot of people in, and make money, but are pretty unproductive in terms of return visits. I believe schoolkids are pretty much a waste of time. Very few of them stick with it.

2 The casuals you get will not have much committment to anything other than a few bowls rolled down with friends whenever they feel like it however. You will not get many (if any) to jump straight from that level of commitment to making themselves available for a whole Saturday afternoon, every Saturday for 18 weeks. With rare exceptions, they just won't. Some intermediate level competition has to be devised, that will require a bit more commitment than just playing casually, but not much more. You might start by organising one-off two hour three bowl triples tournaments in the evening, for casuals. The next stage might be organised 2 hour games of triples once a week - perhaps 6 teams (of 3 people) playing each other once. That would be a five week competition. Mufti, bare feet OK, club bowls provided. Probably best in the evenings - therefore hard outside daylight saving time without lights. Could try mornings if you can organise child-care.

3 The third stage would be to then get them to plays bowls as we know it.

I don't think much of the parasite Clubs, that grow by poaching players from other Clubs .


I don't believe there is much poaching. I reckon most players move clubs after evaluating their aspirations and then measuring it against their current club. Sometimes it's a location thing and sometimes it's a social thing with friends/people of same age at another club.

17-04-2008, 11:11 AM
Poaching would really only be an issue at the higher end of the game. Like who's going to poach a gun Div 3 Lead from Upwey :smile: :smile: :smile:

eelynot
17-04-2008, 11:15 AM
It took time for the waiting lists to dwindle and the lack of foresight from clubs holding dearly onto their little patch. It wasn't a very welcoming game, a lot of pomp and procedure when I joined up. 20 years ago is when the game started its serious decline.But jeez Keefy you tell me, you've been around a lot longer than me...[/quote]

So your to blame :smile: :smile: :smile:

17-04-2008, 11:17 AM
Poaching would really only be an issue at the higher end of the game. Like who's going to poach a gun Div 3 Lead from Upwey :smile: :smile: :smile:



A bit of a furphy really, players tend to send out fealers or leave clubs for one reason or another, usually selection issues or unfair treatment.

RUBC have , for instance, picked up a number of St Kilda players over about three years. These players had left and were picked up after showing interest in Richmond, they came of their own accord.

Good mates can sometimes have an effect on a players movements, but generally players move because they are unhappy. And then there are those that are motivated by the wallet!

Commie
17-04-2008, 11:19 AM
I think you are all overlooking how the sporting landscape has changed in the past 40 years. When I was a kid in a country town (not counting football) the only sports people could play were golf, bowls and tennis. In the bigger centres there was some hockey and basketball/netball.
There are now dozens of sporting options. Bowls will never have the same high percentage of the sport community it did in the laste 50s and early 60s, no matter how it's promoted and advertised.
The game can grow when the people now playing it understand that there needs to be changes to the way its played. Golf has done it by offering different days of play and tee times from dawn until dark, not to mention a wide array of playing styles (par, stroke, stableford, foursomes, ambrose etc).
If we in Victoria can't shift our focus off pennant to offer new alternatives appeal to to people making a sporting choice, then bowls will struggle. Personally I love pennent, but it's a massively long commitment. It's not a good fit for modern society, unfortunately.

17-04-2008, 11:21 AM
I think you are all overlooking how the sporting landscape has changed in the past 40 years. When I was a kid in a country town (not counting football) the only sports people could play were golf, bowls and tennis. In the bigger centres there was some hockey and basketball/netball.
There are now dozens of sporting options. Bowls will never have the same high percentage of the sport community it did in the laste 50s and early 60s, no matter how it's promoted and advertised.
The game can grow when the people now playing it understand that there needs to be changes to the way its played. Golf has done it by offering different days of play and tee times from dawn until dark, not to mention a wide array of playing styles (par, stroke, stableford, foursomes, ambrose etc).
If we in Victoria can't shift our focus off pennant to offer new alternatives appeal to to people making a sporting choice, then bowls will struggle. Personally I love pennent, but it's a massively long commitment. It's not a good fit for modern society, unfortunately.


Pretty sure I mentioned the many alternatives to bowls now available and the golf analogy!

17-04-2008, 11:27 AM
David South has shown us the way to rebuild a club from the dust. I believe a key element of his approach was to sell $50 memberships and capitated everyone, then when they were short they got on the phone and stamped people to play.

Greens Members could be treated in exactly the same manner, pay $50 for an immediate full rights, non voting membership and have the rights to use the grees and clubhouse and also be capitated so as to build up a pool of potential new pennant bowlers.

This approach, similarly to bare foot bowls, is the only one I have seen work so far.

Commie
17-04-2008, 11:41 AM
But this is still a primary focus on pennant ... to get people into the club so they can play pennant. In the long term that won't be productive.
The club focus must be to get them playing bowls at the club, get them playing stuff that requires no equipment or gear outlay first. Blind draw triples is good at doing that. Running club social championships for non-capitated platers is another. Having relaxed turkey triples on a Sunday morning is another. Corporate/sporting challenges under lights on weeknights _ particularly Friday _ is another.
The spinoff is that these recruits will gradually add to they equipment (shoes then cheap bowls and bag then whites) and eventually they'll put their hand up for pennant.
I think this unseemly rush to get newbies in an into pennant teams is a major negative. Too many people feel like they are being press-ganged and switch right off bowls/

damienj
17-04-2008, 02:20 PM
Couldnt agree more with the comments above....

I have mates who ask me how long it runs for on a saturday...I tell them it starts about 12.30 and can sometimes go till 6ish...they scoff at that, telling me its too long a stint on a sat arvo.... I have got some down in the past, stand with them and show them an end, saying how each bowler gets two bowls, bowled alternatively etc etc...they say cool, then i tell them that it happens 25 times!!!! and they scoff again...

Cricket runs similar timeframe...footy slightly less, yet these are acceptable, while bowls "just takes too long!!!"

Never thought id see myself type this, but maybe the 21end, no arvo format might be one way to help this perception?

Of course, much has to be done to get these new bowlers to this stage...

17-04-2008, 02:27 PM
Couldnt agree more with the comments above....

I have mates who ask me how long it runs for on a saturday...I tell them it starts about 12.30 and can sometimes go till 6ish...they scoff at that, telling me its too long a stint on a sat arvo.... I have got some down in the past, stand with them and show them an end, saying how each bowler gets two bowls, bowled alternatively etc etc...they say cool, then i tell them that it happens 25 times!!!! and they scoff again...

Cricket runs similar timeframe...footy slightly less, yet these are acceptable, while bowls "just takes too long!!!"

Never thought id see myself type this, but maybe the 21end, no arvo format might be one way to help this perception?

Of course, much has to be done to get these new bowlers to this stage...
That's one of the questions on a survey to CLUBS at the moment. These sorts of questions should be asked of bowlers, individually.

The RVBA should pay the extra 50c for EACH BOWLER to receive a copy. Or here's a revolutionary idea - put a survey online! If I can do it ...

moosc
17-04-2008, 02:27 PM
have to agree the emphasis on Penant as the be all and end all needs to change. Each club should have probably one or two sides at most. In golf only the chosen few get to play pennant and many a golfer will play his/her time at their club and NEVER be asked to try out for pennant

I have always believed that we should structure bowls like Ten Pin Bowling and participate in Leagues. You could play Saturday in the fours at Coburg, sunday 2 bowl tripples at Reservoir, singles at Fairfield tuesday nights under lights for example. :grin:

Just because it has always been so doesn't mean we need to continue along that path

Neil W

MrInvisible
17-04-2008, 02:46 PM
In metro Vic the majority of players live for the pennant. In the next few years the format may get tweaked but the pennant will remain unless of course the Vic/NSW border gets moved 300+ kms south.

I agree with any plan that will bring participants to our game. My one caveat would be that we not ignore pennant and the plan should have an aim of ensuring a reasonable number of those new participants take up pennant.

17-04-2008, 03:02 PM
In metro Vic the majority of players live for the pennant. In the next few years the format may get tweaked but the pennant will remain unless of course the Vic/NSW border gets moved 300+ kms south.

I agree with any plan that will bring participants to our game. My one caveat would be that we not ignore pennant and the plan should have an aim of ensuring a reasonable number of those new participants take up pennant.
In what sort of timeframe? 6 months? 1 year? 5 years? I don't think you can quantify those sorts of statements and hence they shouldn't become part of a mission/objective.

No one or set of plans that bring new players to the game will be able to meet such a criteria and would be doomed to fail according to those criteria. On the other hand criteria such as:

- an increase of 10% of social bowlers (unaffiliated bowlers) over 2 many years
- an increase in the number of affiliated bowlers by 10% over 5 years
- an increase in Metro Pennant team entries by 15% in 8 years

These can be quantified. The first one would require a little extra recordkeeping and return at club level, but the last two criteria could be gleaned from association data.

But the sticking point that remains is the plans and programs to achieve those. There is no one (or two) silver bullets on this front.

Commie
17-04-2008, 03:12 PM
Michael's right, the onus is on clubs to make the effort to diversify their product away from a strictly pennant/club championship focus. The chronology needs to be:
1. Desire to recruit non-bowlers.
2. Establish variety of on-green events to seduce into the game.
3. Find club people to organise events.
4. Encourage newbies to enjoy their bowls, and that means everyone in the club needs to be positive and friendly.
5. Patience. Clubs need to wait for the bowls drug to hook newbies, not to be a hard-sell pusher scaring people away.

MrInvisible
17-04-2008, 03:15 PM
In metro Vic the majority of players live for the pennant. In the next few years the format may get tweaked but the pennant will remain unless of course the Vic/NSW border gets moved 300+ kms south.

I agree with any plan that will bring participants to our game. My one caveat would be that we not ignore pennant and the plan should have an aim of ensuring a reasonable number of those new participants take up pennant.
In what sort of timeframe? 6 months? 1 year? 5 years? I don't think you can quantify those sorts of statements and hence they shouldn't become part of a mission/objective.

No one or set of plans that bring new players to the game will be able to meet such a criteria and would be doomed to fail according to those criteria. On the other hand criteria such as:

- an increase of 10% of social bowlers (unaffiliated bowlers) over 2 many years
- an increase in the number of affiliated bowlers by 10% over 5 years
- an increase in Metro Pennant team entries by 15% in 8 years

These can be quantified. The first one would require a little extra recordkeeping and return at club level, but the last two criteria could be gleaned from association data.

But the sticking point that remains is the plans and programs to achieve those. There is no one (or two) silver bullets on this front.

I hadn't intended to write a business plan via this forum. My entry into this discussion was to simply to make the point that in trying to devise a way to increase the numbers of bowlers that we should not take our eyes of pennant and the need to keep the numbers up in that regard to.

The %s you mention may be OK but they would have to be analysed in some detail against current trends regarding membership and other factors I guess.

David South
17-04-2008, 03:18 PM
We seem to have a lot of agreement.

We need to get a lot of people into the Club first, to put some bowls down on a casual basis. A lot of Clubs are now doing this.

The end result is to get as many of them as possible playing pennant (in Victoria, anyway). However, it is now clear that it is too much to ask people to jump straight from throwing some bowls down with their friends to committing to pennant. There needs to be some intermediate kind of competition, that requires a bit more commitment, but not too much more. The Clubs can organise this - no need for the Associations to be involved.

Haven't had much discussion yet about the nature of the intermediate competition. I know a number of Clubs are already doing this successfully. Any tips on the best format?

My suggestion was three bowl triples, played to a bell after two hours, perhaps from 7 pm to 9pm. Club bowls, bare feet, mufti. Perhaps start by taking single entries and putting people together when you see who turns up? If people want to play together then let them?

Some token prize for the winner on the night? money, or a cheap trophy?

Commie
17-04-2008, 03:22 PM
Blind draw is best solution, where players are called to a box and pull out a slip of paper/disc/whatever which has rink, team and position allocated. It's a lot of fun, and further helps new players to meet each other.

17-04-2008, 03:23 PM
And what do you do when you get that person who shows an interest in the game, yet even after repeated efforts at coaching shows no ability to adapt at all, is alienated by most because of their inabilty, no one wants them in the team and as such they are bound to leave, because nobody wants to feel unwanted :neutral:
How do you handle these cases?
And I have seen quite a few over the years ;)

Commie
17-04-2008, 03:26 PM
And what do you do when you get that person who shows an interest in the game, yet even after repeated efforts at coaching shows no ability to adapt at all, is alienated by most because of their inabilty, no one wants them in the team and as such they are bound to leave, because nobody wants to feel unwanted :neutral:
How do you handle these cases?
And I have seen quite a few over the years ;)

... they become RVBA administrators. :smile: :smile: :smile: :smile:

David South
17-04-2008, 03:29 PM
Never thought id see myself type this, but maybe the 21end, no arvo format might be one way to help this perception?
Maybe, but I doubt it. I think Pennant will involve too much committment no matter how much you fiddle with the format. If we can get people more committed by introducing additional competitions, I think the current format pennant is fine as the ultimate goal. Of course, not all of them will want to go that far, but that doesn't matter. They will be playing bowls.

Maybe the end result will be that pennant is only for the ultra-committed, and Clubs will have a lot of bowlers who play in other competitions, but not in Pennant. Perhaps we will finish with only a couple of pennant sides in each Club.

David South
17-04-2008, 03:34 PM
And what do you do when you get that person who shows an interest in the game, yet even after repeated efforts at coaching shows no ability to adapt at all, is alienated by most because of their inabilty, no one wants them in the team and as such they are bound to leave, because nobody wants to feel unwanted :neutral:
How do you handle these cases?
And I have seen quite a few over the years ;) In my experience not a serious problem. Mostly, the ones who get interested are the ones who have a bit of potential. Most of the people who have no aptitude for it at all drop out fairly quickly. Some don't - but all Clubs have their quota of people who really can't bowl and never will, but keep hanging around.

Commie
17-04-2008, 04:17 PM
I think the 21-end no-afternoon-tea option has merit in that it can allow two games to be played on the same four rinks on a Saturday, and we can start generating the kind of atmosphere that's at football clubs ie the ones watching the thirds in the morning and vice versa in the arvo, along with the fourth side when it gets back from its away morning encounter.
The morning pennant could start at 10am and the afternoon matches at 2pm.
And that frees up four other rinks for many other bowls activities. It's a thought.

PB
17-04-2008, 04:30 PM
I think the 21-end no-afternoon-tea option has merit in that it can allow two games to be played on the same four rinks on a Saturday, and we can start generating the kind of atmosphere that's at football clubs ie the ones watching the thirds in the morning and vice versa in the arvo, along with the fourth side when it gets back from its away morning encounter.
The morning pennant could start at 10am and the afternoon matches at 2pm.
And that frees up four other rinks for many other bowls activities. It's a thought.

Starting pennant at 2pm would definitely help attract more people to it. Considering we waste 30-45 minutes every Saturday listening to the same crappy speaches, this is effectively 4-5 ends of play. 21 ends straight through should take just under 3 hours for the lower grades and jsut over 3 hours for Div 2 and up. This involves much less time to be commited by players.

Unfortunately I can't see it happening as too many of the administrators like their cup of tea. Personally I'd be happy to skip the tea and the fruit cake some clubs offer for a beer after the game.

17-04-2008, 04:47 PM
Some put up the argument that without the Tea and Bikkies break they lose money by not having their "Swindle" for a half a dozen stubbies or whatever (In reality just another way of extracting extra green fees ;) )
Hell they still have a swindle after the game in NSW and still collect plenty from it so cant see that as a valid one, and anyhow, sell the tickets for the swindle before the game then you can be sure many will stick around after to see if they won a few stubbies for the trip home ;)

damienj
17-04-2008, 05:11 PM
I think the 21-end no-afternoon-tea option has merit in that it can allow two games to be played on the same four rinks on a Saturday, and we can start generating the kind of atmosphere that's at football clubs ie the ones watching the thirds in the morning and vice versa in the arvo, along with the fourth side when it gets back from its away morning encounter.
The morning pennant could start at 10am and the afternoon matches at 2pm.
And that frees up four other rinks for many other bowls activities. It's a thought.

That sounds like a bloody great idea!!! And think of the extra bar sales!!! I know id hang around...would be the perfect pre-drink warm up to a night on the town! And the atmosphere...think of the atmosphere!

The swindle could still happen after....hell, if a good prize gets put up for a change, it might even entice people to stay....OR, put green fees up a buck and include 3 raffle tickets per player with the cards at the start of the day...suddenly you've got 3 "free" tickets and would be foolish NOT to hang around and see if your number comes up!! :cool:

18-04-2008, 10:13 AM
But this is still a primary focus on pennant ... to get people into the club so they can play pennant. In the long term that won't be productive.
The club focus must be to get them playing bowls at the club, get them playing stuff that requires no equipment or gear outlay first. Blind draw triples is good at doing that. Running club social championships for non-capitated platers is another. Having relaxed turkey triples on a Sunday morning is another. Corporate/sporting challenges under lights on weeknights _ particularly Friday _ is another.
The spinoff is that these recruits will gradually add to they equipment (shoes then cheap bowls and bag then whites) and eventually they'll put their hand up for pennant.
I think this unseemly rush to get newbies in an into pennant teams is a major negative. Too many people feel like they are being press-ganged and switch right off bowls/



I was talking about St Kilda and David's experience where they also have a Community Bowls section to cater, presumably for the other such activities you talk about. I again I would imagine the most eager of this group would have been asked first.

I fully agree that intergrating other non affiliated events into the club's calendar is a complementary way of increasing newbie activity. I am yet to see the type of results from that type of activity that David got, leading to a hoarde of new bowlers who have started enriching the clubs in Melbourne, as many ex St Kilda players have moved on. He even saved Albert Park on the run through.

My point is these models have worked and little else has.

David South
18-04-2008, 10:52 AM
I fully agree that intergrating other non affiliated events into the club's calendar is a complementary way of increasing newbie activity. I am yet to see the type of results from that type of activity that David got, leading to a hoarde of new bowlers who have started enriching the clubs in Melbourne, as many ex St Kilda players have moved on. He even saved Albert Park on the run through.

My point is these models have worked and little else has.
At St Kilda we succeeded in getting a small number of casuals - and some who came to the Club for other reasons - committed to the point where they would play pennant. It was a very small number. We then got these people to lean on their friends to play too. That worked, and built the numbers up quite a lot - but it took years. And as I have said before, to get people to lean on their friends to play pennant you have to have more spots than players, and have to be able to say that you are short and need them. There seems to be very strong opposition to doing this from forum members. I don't know of any other method that has been successful in significantly building up the numbers of pennant players. Few people will make themselves available for pennant if you already have enough players and don't need them. (recruiting players from other clubs works too of course - whether you call it poaching or not - but does nothing to bring new players in to the game. Robbing Peter to pay Paul. I still call them parasite clubs).

I am suggesting the intermediate competitions as another way of working people up to the degree of committment needed for pennant, especially to those who are ideologically opposed to the approach that worked at St Kilda.

And Albert Park have rejuvenated themselves. Nothing more than a few suggestions from me.

18-04-2008, 11:02 AM
I fully agree that intergrating other non affiliated events into the club's calendar is a complementary way of increasing newbie activity. I am yet to see the type of results from that type of activity that David got, leading to a hoarde of new bowlers who have started enriching the clubs in Melbourne, as many ex St Kilda players have moved on. He even saved Albert Park on the run through.

My point is these models have worked and little else has.
At St Kilda we succeeded in getting a small number of casuals - and some who came to the Club for other reasons - committed to the point where they would play pennant. It was a very small number. We then got these people to lean on their friends to play too. That worked, and built the numbers up quite a lot - but it took years. And as I have said before, to get people to lean on their friends to play pennant you have to have more spots than players, and have to be able to say that you are short and need them. There seems to be very strong opposition to doing this from forum members. I don't know of any other method that has been successful in significantly building up the numbers of pennant players. Few people will make themselves available for pennant if you already have enough players and don't need them. (recruiting players from other clubs works too of course - whether you call it poaching or not - but does nothing to bring new players in to the game. Robbing Peter to pay Paul. I still call them parasite clubs).

I am suggesting the intermediate competitions as another way of working people up to the degree of committment needed for pennant, especially to those who are ideologically opposed to the approach that worked at St Kilda.

And Albert Park have rejuvenated themselves. Nothing more than a few suggestions from me.


You are far too modest, the early days when you had teams playing out of there and the ex St Kilda people who have gone there and indeed have some responsibilities there is down to you pushing the barrow.

There has never been a club that was as dead as St Kilda come back to life with such fervour and success.

David South
18-04-2008, 11:03 AM
St Kilda also got quite a few new members from a competition that the RVBA actually ran for one season - about 1995, I think. It was a twilight three bowl triples, for sides of three teams (ie 9 players). In mufti, and mixed. St Kilda entered 4 sides, and then a number of people spent a lot of time on the phone filling the spots every week. Very successful, from our point of view - though we won very few games. The RVBA dropped the competition after one year. I think St Kilda was the only Club using it to recruit. We played against a lot of other Clubs, most of whom only put in one side.

Might be worth the RVBA having another look at the concept now?

Commie
18-04-2008, 11:04 AM
Hey Uncle Ken, let's tell them how we got into bowls.
At the Only Paper in Wagga, there was a social club called the Caxton Club that played golf regurlarly. One of its members decided it could do the same thing with bowls, so we got a bus and about 20 or so of us headed off to clubs like Coolamon and some place near Tumut and all over the Wagga region. We played bowls against them and drank heaps and it was a f*cking lot of fun. And from it about 13 joined South Wagga. And none of us were capitated until we joined SW.
Many of these things are do-able if clubs have the desire and willingness to embrace different recruitment processes

Uncle Ken
18-04-2008, 11:33 AM
Aaaaah our wonderful trip to Adelong.If I didn't get so drunk I would tell you about it. :smile:
We were certainly made welcome where ever we went.Great days takings for them and great fun for us.It certainly was a great introduction to how much fun bowls could be.Once we took the wives on a trip to Griffith, did the winery tours played bowls and all the men fell asleep coming home.Good old night workers. :smile:
I still love a bus trip.That's how we travel to Nyngan (7hrs) every year.
and most of us are still playing.

M
19-04-2008, 09:43 AM
My experiences at many clubs that I have visited tell me that, there is a lot of people out there in non-bowling land, that would love to give our game a try. However, they dont know how. Clubs dont have entry level opportunities posted on notice boards outside, or websites that are entry level-centric, all the information seems to be focussed on members or drinkers.
How does your club stack up in this regard? Signage that says "come on in and have a crack at this great game" Free to give it a go. Come along on sunday morning at 11 and have a go, obligation free, its easier that n you think and the best fun you can have with your clothes on!
You club website should have the same info.
Pamphlets and flyers could be printed and distributed by all members, say 100 each in their street and surrounds, on an ongoing basis.

How is that for a start?

There are clubs doing just that at the moment (with different words of course) and getting more than a pennant team a year in new players.

4TG
20-04-2008, 10:49 AM
And what do you do when you get that person who shows an interest in the game, yet even after repeated efforts at coaching shows no ability to adapt at all, is alienated by most because of their inabilty, no one wants them in the team and as such they are bound to leave, because nobody wants to feel unwanted :neutral:
How do you handle these cases?
And I have seen quite a few over the years ;)

A lot of people with personality disorders (not good mixers or shy) even
though they might have potential, drift away too.
It is up to the players in the club to look after them untill they can
find friends & start enjoying the experience.
Too many players get into cliques when rolling/practicing & others feel
isolated, someone with influence (selector or office bearer) should
discourage this.
On my travels north in winter in a few cases some clubs have a meeter
& greeter who approach new faces, find out what they are about &
invite them for a game of social bowls.
It is up to us as club members to be friendly & accommodating to
visitors/newbies.
I remember Buderim especially gave my wife & I a great
social visit.
Things like introducing visitors at afternoon tea & presenting them with
a momento of their visit make their experience memorable.
Such clubs will never be short of members.

Uncle Ken
20-04-2008, 11:02 AM
While your there M can you tell me how RNSWBA can start up this Target Bowls format to run in conjunction with Premier League and not inform the clubs involved ? (or was it just us)
Our club knew nothing of this until the media release from Greg Helm and the cardboard brochures were put around tables Friday night.It say's "BCS & BOWLS NSW ARE PLEASED TO LAUNCH ..."
We don't mind having these things run at our club but it would be nice to be asked.
We had an end of pennant night planned and knew nothing of this, yet the brochure has dates for 13th April, 19th April etc.
I realise Premier League has people excited but the reality is that this is still our club and to not even inform the President of the bowling club that they wish to use our facilities is getting a bit rough.
How can we find the passion to attract new people when the die-hard supporters are being bulldozed over.
I'm disappointed for our President and committee.
or should I send Greg an e-mail ?

M
20-04-2008, 04:30 PM
Unc,
Anything you say to me will be repeated to greg anyway,
The Target Bowls is a promotion that has only just and i mean in the last 2 weeks got traction. In terms of your club, it shold have little if any effect on anything else you inted to do.
The guys will paint a target on your green, you can make a gold coin donation to have a crack at the target if you would like to. The gold coin goes to a great cause "Kids with grit"
I guess Greg should have asked the zone president and the district president and the club president and the zone Councillor but when it is all said and done, the only thing that is being asked of your club is to paint a small multi coloured target on the green and to give spectators a crack at the target for charity.
Mate i dont want to upset anyone, and i know greg certainly wouldnt want to be upsetting anyone either. Certainly dont want to embarrass anyone either.

Uncle Ken
20-04-2008, 09:12 PM
That was all done and it seemed to go off well.(good cause no worries).
The thing that gets under my skin is the fact that brochures were printed with dates , yet permission from our committee was never sought. :???:
The President of the Bowls Club knew nothing and was never consulted so that is what annoy's me.
If our club is to be run for the purpose of Zone 8 without our imput then after 25 years of playing and being on committee's that will do me.
Bring on the rebellion. :shock:
I'm going fishing.

21-04-2008, 10:55 AM
My experiences at many clubs that I have visited tell me that, there is a lot of people out there in non-bowling land, that would love to give our game a try. However, they dont know how. Clubs dont have entry level opportunities posted on notice boards outside, or websites that are entry level-centric, all the information seems to be focussed on members or drinkers.
How does your club stack up in this regard? Signage that says "come on in and have a crack at this great game" Free to give it a go. Come along on sunday morning at 11 and have a go, obligation free, its easier that n you think and the best fun you can have with your clothes on!
You club website should have the same info.
Pamphlets and flyers could be printed and distributed by all members, say 100 each in their street and surrounds, on an ongoing basis.

How is that for a start?

There are clubs doing just that at the moment (with different words of course) and getting more than a pennant team a year in new players.



FREE! NEVER! What you have described is atypical of the failed approach of the past.A lot of clubs in Mexico have had those signs up for years to no avail. What has worked is charging them to play so they at least value the opportunity. Open days are a crock!

Swifty
21-04-2008, 12:42 PM
But this is still a primary focus on pennant ... to get people into the club so they can play pennant. In the long term that won't be productive.
The club focus must be to get them playing bowls at the club, get them playing stuff that requires no equipment or gear outlay first. Blind draw triples is good at doing that. Running club social championships for non-capitated platers is another. Having relaxed turkey triples on a Sunday morning is another. Corporate/sporting challenges under lights on weeknights _ particularly Friday _ is another.
The spinoff is that these recruits will gradually add to they equipment (shoes then cheap bowls and bag then whites) and eventually they'll put their hand up for pennant.
I think this unseemly rush to get newbies in an into pennant teams is a major negative. Too many people feel like they are being press-ganged and switch right off bowls/

WHAT????? You have non-capitated bowlers using your greens? :shock:

There was a club over here that was fined heaps by BowlsWA for doing that!

21-04-2008, 12:49 PM
But this is still a primary focus on pennant ... to get people into the club so they can play pennant. In the long term that won't be productive.
The club focus must be to get them playing bowls at the club, get them playing stuff that requires no equipment or gear outlay first. Blind draw triples is good at doing that. Running club social championships for non-capitated platers is another. Having relaxed turkey triples on a Sunday morning is another. Corporate/sporting challenges under lights on weeknights _ particularly Friday _ is another.
The spinoff is that these recruits will gradually add to they equipment (shoes then cheap bowls and bag then whites) and eventually they'll put their hand up for pennant.
I think this unseemly rush to get newbies in an into pennant teams is a major negative. Too many people feel like they are being press-ganged and switch right off bowls/

WHAT????? You have non-capitated bowlers using your greens? :shock:

There was a club over here that was fined heaps by BowlsWA for doing that!




Thousands of them! The RVBA, through Group 16 was given a chance to assist when corporate bowls was started here but they just laughed and said it would never work.

Members of this forum, at least one I know of, were there the night it was offered to them, and they said I could kill myself trying with their blessing.
Their response, some years later, was Get On The Green, a total waste of money and energy.


Now they have no chance of standing over Vic clubs.

M
21-04-2008, 01:23 PM
I hear you, regarding the cost factor, and all, But Im simply relaying what is working for several clubs.

Swifty
21-04-2008, 01:50 PM
We have two categories of social members. Normal social members can't use the greens by BowlsWA's rules. Social bowlers are capitated and can play in social comps, but not pennants or Club championships.